Did you not say you had an F31 with the ZF8? Knocking to the left doesn't do this. It downcogs by 1 gear and engages the sport mode for the gearbox, and cuts out stop start. It's still much easier than changing gear in a manual.
I recently drove a new Macan GTS PDK and the PDK is good, but in normal driving it's certainly no better than the ZF8.
Now I will grant you the DCT in my M4 Competition was far from ideal for daily driving, it's ok, but the ZF8 is far better in traffic etc.
I'd be very interested to sit next to you and observe these things you mention, I've never had my ZF8 try and change up a gear as I approach a roundabout for example!
It's been a couple of years since I owned it and I've owned 4 cars since, so could well have been mistaken
Have no problem with the ZF8 for going from 0 to 70. It's the in-between gear changes where I struggle with it.
I never said it changes up as I approach it. It changes as I'm in the roundabout, so when I go to accelerate, it's in the middle of changing from 3rd to 4th, for example. I hate systems making choices for me. Let me do it myself. Auto high beam? Get in the bin.
Because stop-start traffic with adaptive cruise control works seamlessly with an automatic, and the ZF8 speed is amazing.
A manual is perfect in a Caterham, simple sports car or a **** box, but for daily driving I don't know why you wouldn't get a ZF auto.
Not all auto boxes are good though - the one VAG uses in its Golfs, etc. is a total POS.
But I've said quite a few times now that I don't drive in traffic, nor will it have adaptive cruise a the price I'm looking at.
I've listed so many reasons why I PERSONALLY wouldn't buy a ZF. I've not said other people shouldn't. I've even stated that I recommend it for other people.
Because you can't put a manual into auto mode when you're in traffic or driving around town and because manuals are much harder to buy?
I don't drive in traffic
Nor do I drive around towns.
Hard to buy doesn't mean impossible. Why is that even a valid reason to not get one?
"Don't buy that car on Auto trader because it's only one of six, when there are over 100 automatics you could have instead" - c'mon dude, that makes no sense.
If you don't care about speed you won't need kickdown. It'll just smoothly and seamlessly accelerate back to whatever speed you want. There is simply nothing to do with your gearbox on a Motorway or a dual carriageway if you don't care about speed and care about ease. Caring about ease of use rather than speed is basically the entire point the automatic gearbox existed in the first place.
I respect that everyones experiences are different (But it's an interesting argument anyway!) but I just can't relate to this problem you've had on dual carriageways and Motorways. I never think about what gear I am in on those roads - if I want to accelerate I just do so, the gearbox sorts everything out quickly and smoothly. You often don't even notice it shift down if it only goes down one gear. Obviously you'll notice if you use kickdown but if you're using that you obviously want maximum performance so doesn't really matter.
I can think of no better combination than a decent engine and this gearbox for effortless motorway driving with a petrol or diesel engine car. It just works. It is much smoother than dual clutch gearboxes, so I am surprised you've found one of those to be smoother. I don't think I've ever heard of a case of a dual clutch being smoother than a traditional torque convertor.
But it does kickdown, in my experience.
The auto is programmed to be in the highest possible gear for a speed. So if I'm at 35 in 7th at 1000 RPM it's always going to change down to accelerate (just an example - I don't know which speed corresponds to which gear)
Can't comment much for the PDK in other cars, as I've not spent excessive time in them. I have driven a panamera and Macan GTS and the PDKs in those cars felt quite different from mine and the 911 I drove shortly after. Calibrated for traffic and general use, I imagine.
The PDK in my car is ace. It's dead smooth. But it still changes gear mid corner, in roundabouts and at times I don't want it to. It's just that it is programmed so well that it's EXTREMELY responsive to any throttle input, regardless of the mode I'm in. The ZF8, in my experience, isn't.
The bottom line is that I just enjoy changing gear, even in traffic. I get driving enjoyment from moving the gearstick from 2 to 3. Car/speed irrelevant.
On the motorway the 8th zf gear probably has a lower ratio, than manual 6th, so may have some additional motorway fuel economy/lower emissions.
cursory google 5th manual like 6th on zf, 6th man 0.846, zf 8th 0.64 ... but maybe there is a final drive ratio to plugin too ; I'm doubting fuel is 5% less at 70mph though, but if it were ....
[being able to manually drop multiple gears directly, too what is required, at roundabout, is another point)
Gear ratio isn't everything. ZF has parasitic loss due to the power required to operate.
From memory, in real world usage, the S drive F30 320d manual on the motorway was more efficient than the S drive 320d auto, at least pre-lci before they updated the ZF with the more efficient version. I only ever saw high 40s in my F31 320d XDrive on a journey from south coast to Wales. I get 40 in my Boxster.
I'm not sure it is possible to talk sense to someone who wanted a "sporty engaging drive" who has ended up with a low spec 320D manual as their goal
I know you're not stupid enough to make up the fact I wanted a "sporty engaging drive".
I've literally got a mid engined sports car for sporty driving.
In fact, for further evidence of why I like manuals - I didn't get one in the 981 because:
- Long gear ratios - over 70 in 2nd, so no real gear changing opportunity for sporty drives
- NA 3.4L engine results in low torque for low RPM pull. Auto is better in this example.
Honestly this conversation is bonkers, IMO.
"I prefer manual"
"You're wrong"
I've been having the same discussion with sales people.
"Auto is easier"
"Auto is more efficient"
"Don't have to replace the clutch"
Great, but I WANT a manual.